From: Isabel Foxen Duke <isabel.duke@gmail.com>
To: Bitcoin Development Mailing List <bitcoindev@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Hourglass V2 Update
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2026 10:47:06 -0800 (PST) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <4b02a925-663f-423f-8905-0fc1b528581fn@googlegroups.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAN7kyNh=qzAiGvDBpLSJLVt64smR+HQh+w+Hm3cZGebZejJsqw@mail.gmail.com>
[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 6165 bytes --]
> [1 BTC] can be replaced with something else. For example, if things are
based on the coinbase reward, then these rules can be wired into consensus.
Which means, that if the current block reward is 3.125 BTC plus fees, then
P2PKs can be limited to be X% of the coinbase, and not more than that.
I don't mind this idea — however, I worry it could add complexity from a
user experience perspective. 1 BTC might actually make sense and not be so
arbitrary—as it will be an easy number for people to track and understand
what coins they can move or are moving at any given time. Hyper-simplicity
has UX and comms benefits.
-Isabel
On Tuesday, February 17, 2026 at 9:11:45 AM UTC-4 Garlo Nicon wrote:
> > My primary complaint is that 1 BTC per block is somewhat arbitrary.
>
> > Hourglass V2 further restricts the output amount to a maximum of 1
> bitcoin per block, or roughly 144 bitcoin per day. This is far less than
> the 450 coins per day introduced by the current block reward subsidy, and
> should effectively mitigate the market impacts of quantum attacks on P2PK
> coins.
>
> It can be replaced with something else. For example, if things are based
> on the coinbase reward, then these rules can be wired into consensus. Which
> means, that if the current block reward is 3.125 BTC plus fees, then P2PKs
> can be limited to be X% of the coinbase, and not more than that. It would
> still be arbitrary, but it would be more aligned with the explanation from
> the BIP, that it is all about how many coins are introduced into
> circulation, or assigned to miners.
>
> Or, if it would be based only on the basic block reward, without fees,
> then when all coins will be mined, P2PKs will automatically expire, because
> there won't be any amount, which is less than zero satoshis. Because things
> can be based on fees, but then, a large miner with many coins, could game
> the system, and turn some of his own coins into fees, only to unlock more
> P2PK coins.
>
> pon., 16 lut 2026 o 23:11 Jameson Lopp <jameso...@gmail.com> napisał(a):
>
>> Bitcoin is ultimately a system of rules that are enforced by those who
>> use the system and hold the keys to spend UTXOs. As such, if a sufficiently
>> large cohort of economic power within the system is interested in
>> protecting itself against massive liquidation events from malicious actors
>> who arguably are not the rightful owners of UTXOs, the incentives are in
>> place for them to do something about it.
>>
>> I like Hourglass V2 a lot more than V1. My primary complaint is that 1
>> BTC per block is somewhat arbitrary. It would be interesting to point to
>> the on-chain statistics of what P2PK UTXO spend volume we have seen in
>> recent years.
>>
>> Additionally, in the context of my own migration BIP, Hourglass V2 could
>> be complementary to the concept of offering a ZK quantum safe spending
>> option for folks who fail to migrate UTXOs to quantum safe scripts before a
>> set deadline, given that these old P2PK outputs do not belong to HD wallets
>> and thus the owners would be incapable of constructing a ZK proof of HD
>> wallet ownership.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 13, 2026 at 5:12 PM Light <bitco...@lightco.in> wrote:
>>
>>> Bitcoin should not have an in-protocol plunge protection mechanism, and
>>> certainly not one that artificially restricts people's ability to spend
>>> their coins. I encourage you to withdraw this proposal, for the sake of
>>> bitcoin's integrity and utility as a p2p electronic cash system.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Feb 10, 2026, at 3:47 PM, Mike Casey wrote:
>>> > In response to feedback, the Hourglass proposal to mitigate against
>>> > potential mass liquidation of P2PK funds has been enhanced to further
>>> > limit spend amounts from such outputs to only 1 bitcoin per block.
>>> >
>>> https://github.com/cryptoquick/bips/blob/hourglass-v2/bip-hourglass-v2.mediawiki
>>> >
>>> > Prior discussion of the original Hourglass proposal:
>>> > https://groups.google.com/g/bitcoindev/c/zmg3U117aNc/m/lDCMs9j7EAAJ
>>> >
>>> > Thoughts & feedback welcome!
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> > Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
>>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> > an email to bitcoindev+...@googlegroups.com.
>>> > To view this discussion visit
>>> >
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/9336f5a4-5c28-4c1b-af29-a8462b7a9377n%40googlegroups.com
>>> > <
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/9336f5a4-5c28-4c1b-af29-a8462b7a9377n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>>> >.
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> an email to bitcoindev+...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion visit
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/57bd09bc-1c1b-4605-82f9-65b6b61cf8a2%40app.fastmail.com
>>> .
>>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to bitcoindev+...@googlegroups.com.
>>
> To view this discussion visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/CADL_X_eb8byZs3VKORoUzaPoBvguSbxJ%3DKyKifsQFWFqyqHeRA%40mail.gmail.com
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/CADL_X_eb8byZs3VKORoUzaPoBvguSbxJ%3DKyKifsQFWFqyqHeRA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/4b02a925-663f-423f-8905-0fc1b528581fn%40googlegroups.com.
[-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 9947 bytes --]
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2026-02-23 18:51 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 12+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2026-02-10 20:47 Mike Casey
2026-02-13 22:06 ` Light
2026-02-16 22:03 ` Jameson Lopp
2026-02-17 0:31 ` Light
2026-02-17 13:02 ` Garlo Nicon
2026-02-17 13:24 ` Isabel Foxen Duke
2026-02-23 18:47 ` Isabel Foxen Duke [this message]
2026-02-25 14:39 ` Bob Burnett
2026-02-25 16:46 ` Jameson Lopp
2026-02-18 14:33 ` Mike Casey
2026-02-19 3:26 ` Alex
2026-02-21 6:22 ` neonrooks
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=4b02a925-663f-423f-8905-0fc1b528581fn@googlegroups.com \
--to=isabel.duke@gmail.com \
--cc=bitcoindev@googlegroups.com \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox