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[2607:f8b0:4864:20::536]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id af79cd13be357-9158a347bcbsi26966785a.7.2026.06.04.20.52.40 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 04 Jun 2026 20:52:40 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of sergio.d.lerner@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::536 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::536; Received: by mail-pg1-x536.google.com with SMTP id 41be03b00d2f7-c85d4b4245aso918940a12.1 for ; Thu, 04 Jun 2026 20:52:40 -0700 (PDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1780631559; cv=none; d=google.com; s=arc-20240605; b=Y0dWOEFLmyH5+wWrfWQm5m8Njk5IFA1BwIzWG66S+QOK4SDJ4G+4shZluDxSXX4qvG 0ol7Y9XO7lJWHhEDjw9gfzGwAj0pi3JLExjwwB/DUWUOcnRAAGnhW55LV07qxHZd3G5v JE0mf/bH1/ZyuwXmqfljA+ysn6+8uvHp6y+s3YOMNTx1x+w69pq8IIXPes4qosepAHFM otTH5K4VW9nglohsthF+BjrF7++IRDfkOSjc7omRoOEVBkydV3ddOtP5cWlH4rJ3cK5N xLD7gXGT9leJIF0krC1mGP8ifYRsZ2lak7yrdDom3uyiDtNtB7GJQtnHeCO1IeZiuX56 3rMw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=arc-20240605; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:dkim-signature; bh=cpEriNFYk3Ze59JxaaJjIo6S/qc2NEJbW2dGmFdGW0k=; fh=+Duu3Cp77aXfHDD1ma61XeBuViahPkcQ600hmLognUE=; b=VIhNjp58wUc1bvasCQbeqwlnXoPiCVWhfD2W82Q5iKwXgojXaiU0TDV7E0FrhuWWIQ 6inxy2h7FfAdai4G402cYSA0U1QqlW8SPme2sgJj+ziTuhikMTeTiJjxKV2xzJD370wA eqEFIWen/c844Q9BCCin1d9j2yj9zbym0TNR8rEgnEgJFiNpq6oerQ3876ADq4bPyTZE 8CD1Kzy/WDJl083bPWXFrNMF7zcYo4uZ+5G19Dn4ElMH7bKOux3LYyAMnEBvqffy6975 V+Yluecu+WeSfUJjBPvN8dQAx7wbLkCWhXSHeBNOuVpQT8P30Hvo0uinnENuptvHv+sq r9+A==; dara=google.com ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.google.com; arc=none X-Gm-Gg: Acq92OFTFG9o8nmiySjkWXMVJt88KY4Kc42IclR2BVYvCS/YbvNmaM47IDbVwedaMGS EDWWQSl8LjxIs1VQImCZT0uDbEhw0auAWWQNcOKwZO24h4QU5TBZl0ykjpy4WBFkkxO+7GaL/rk YyWjL0pm/3sDSkCrlOdJb6AJA4RMDOMJETAxR7WY/mrZSqDGugJxnCF48uwgHWi6xAfufhU4esi 6IF2fb7epJuNXGdFAQXb/gCxL2y5sC/VbVvxjY8LS/a2+cVqSjP8s1kF2TRoqTxfd4TLZOoTYIG 7s2voNeX7ZyLoEMVEQ== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6a21:103:b0:3b4:b275:c5b1 with SMTP id adf61e73a8af0-3b4ccf5e49fmr2056825637.26.1780631558920; Thu, 04 Jun 2026 20:52:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9001a42f-b497-41c1-895d-3ec902f2413cn@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: <9001a42f-b497-41c1-895d-3ec902f2413cn@googlegroups.com> From: Sergio Demian Lerner Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2026 00:52:02 -0300 X-Gm-Features: AVHnY4KFSETkm7Rw7qSj-Cs4ZSJj7xUYZjBgDPqIp44JIWUfHqlKZ_S7I9pi_CM Message-ID: Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Re: Knowledge Gathering: SPV Proof Applications In the Wild and Proposed To: jeremy Cc: Bitcoin Development Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008b9c0b065379974e" X-Original-Sender: sergio.d.lerner@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20251104 header.b=rAv43NpZ; arc=pass (i=1); spf=pass (google.com: domain of sergio.d.lerner@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::536 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=sergio.d.lerner@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com; dara=pass header.i=@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) --0000000000008b9c0b065379974e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rootstock uses SPV proofs to power its Bitcoin SPV node that runs in consensus inside the Bridge smart contract. The bridge uses SPV proofs to accept peg-ins and peg-outs change, after 100 Bitcoin confirmations. The system is decentralized: any user can submit Bitcoin headers to build the Bridge view of Bitcoin. The Bridge maintains the canonical chain and all potential forks. All forks can be extended with block headers having the right PoW. The codebase is based on Bitcoinj. The system has been running since 2018 without interruptions. The SPV proof verifier is protected from Merkle node type confusions (64-byte txs). Sergio On Mon, May 25, 2026 at 3:37=E2=80=AFPM jeremy w= rote: > I received the below as reply-one and am forwarding with permission: > > ------ > > > Hi Jeremy, > > This is a presentation I did in 2016 on SPV as "Satoshi's scaling > solution". > > There are no new types of proofs, just old fashioned proofs-of-coin and > proofs-of-spend. My approach was to try to envision what the whole networ= k > would need to look like. > > A common objection to SPV was that full nodes would be "overloaded", so I > introduced spv-serving light nodes with different services. > > A key idea (which is not stated explicitly in the slides) is for a node t= o > advertise interest in a set of tx hash stems for which it would provide > proof services, and for which it wanted to be relayed transactions. The > set would contain stems of varying lengths that could be as short as 1 he= x > character or as long as some max. > > Wallets would do this same registration to cause transactions to be route= d > to themselves. Nearly all of those stems would be randomly introduced fo= r > privacy. > > Bloom filters are mentioned as part of a transaction repeater service but > that was for compatibility with existing SPV wallets of the time. The ma= in > idea was to achieve scaling and privacy by the registration scheme. > > Hope it's useful in some way! > > > Cheers, > Tom Harding > > > On Thursday, May 14, 2026 at 10:47:59=E2=80=AFAM UTC-4 jeremy wrote: > >> Dear Bitcoin Developers, >> >> SPV proofs are an important part of Bitcoin's Design, after all Satoshi >> thought they were worth including in the whitepaper! >> >> As far as I'm aware, they have somewhat limited usage in the wild, mainl= y >> in Electrum and in Layer 2 Bridges, but it is important that they work >> correctly. >> >> I'd like to gather a bit more detailed information on where and how SPV >> proofs are currently used, as well as any other proposed uses of SPV pro= ofs. >> >> In this Knowledge Gathering, I'd also like to glean a better >> understanding of what types of commitment structures might work "better" >> than others for SPV -- e.g., ability to cheaply verify if a block pays a >> particular address, spends a particular coin, and the exclusion forms (d= oes >> not pay an address, does not spend a coin) etc, especially in the contex= t >> of Layer 2 Bridging. >> >> Happy International Chihuahua Appreciation Day, >> >> Jeremy >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/9001a42f-b497-41c1-895d-3ec9= 02f2413cn%40googlegroups.com > > . > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/= CAKzdR-pSKPXjBnWJZMASDRZve5Y1ekeTo7eG_f%3DWV-vVn1xZPQ%40mail.gmail.com. --0000000000008b9c0b065379974e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Rootstock uses SPV proofs to power its Bitcoin SPV node th= at runs in consensus inside the Bridge smart contract. The bridge uses SPV = proofs to accept peg-ins and peg-outs change, after 100 Bitcoin confirmatio= ns.
The system is decentralized: any user can submit Bitcoin headers to= build the Bridge view of Bitcoin. The Bridge maintains the canonical=C2=A0= chain and all potential forks. All forks can be extended with block headers= having the right PoW.
The codebase is based on Bitcoinj.
The system has been running since 2018 without interruptions.
=
The SPV proof verifier is protected from Merkle node type confus= ions (64-byte txs).

Sergio

On Mon, May 25, 2026 at 3:37=E2=80=AFPM jeremy <jeremy.l.rubin@gmail.com> wrote:

I received the= below as reply-one and am forwarding with permission:

----= --


Hi Jeremy,

This is = a presentation I did in 2016 on SPV as "Satoshi's scaling solution= ".

There are no new types of proofs, just old fashione= d proofs-of-coin and proofs-of-spend. My approach was to try to envision wh= at the whole network would need to look like.

A common obje= ction to SPV was that full nodes would be "overloaded", so I intr= oduced spv-serving light nodes with different services.

A k= ey idea (which is not stated explicitly in the slides) is for a node to adv= ertise interest in a set of tx hash stems for which it would provide proof = services, and for which it wanted to be relayed transactions.=C2=A0 The set= would contain stems of varying lengths that could be as short as 1 hex cha= racter or as long as some max.

Wallets would do this same r= egistration to cause transactions to be routed to themselves.=C2=A0 Nearly = all of those stems would be randomly introduced for privacy.

Hope it's useful in some way!


Cheer= s,
Tom=C2=A0Harding



On Thursday, May 14, 2026 at 10:47:59=E2=80=AFAM U= TC-4 jeremy wrote:
Dear Bitcoin Developers,

SPV proofs are an important part = of Bitcoin's Design, after all Satoshi thought they were worth includin= g in the whitepaper!

As far as I'm aware, they have = somewhat limited usage in the wild, mainly in Electrum and in Layer 2 Bridg= es, but it is important that they work correctly.

I&= #39;d like to gather a bit more detailed information on where and how SPV p= roofs are currently used, as well as any other proposed uses of SPV proofs.=

In this Knowledge Gathering, I'd also like to= glean a better understanding of what types of commitment structures might = work "better" than others for SPV -- e.g., ability to cheaply ver= ify if a block pays a particular address, spends a particular coin, and the= exclusion forms (does not pay an address, does not spend a coin) etc, espe= cially in the context of Layer 2 Bridging.

Happy I= nternational Chihuahua Appreciation Day,

Jeremy

--
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To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.googl= e.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/9001a42f-b497-41c1-895d-3ec902f2413cn%40googlegrou= ps.com.

--
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