From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Delivery-date: Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:43:04 -0700 Received: from mail-oa1-f58.google.com ([209.85.160.58]) by mail.fairlystable.org with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1x4NGC-0006FI-9e for bitcoindev@gnusha.org; Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:43:04 -0700 Received: by mail-oa1-f58.google.com with SMTP id 586e51a60fabf-469debb527fsf4658860fac.1 for ; Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:43:04 -0700 (PDT) ARC-Seal: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; t=1788979378; cv=pass; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; b=ieD8NAagIIR598quz0onRm/xcRkU2V1BRmPyq+DY2V3mw0G8ncxxI37Fq4+cnEO7Qm 8B4RLZu89b0dGsLv+QGPYQjbUasP9xQlFXxq6RSWho/SY5IeC/PSrzPYFngyBoeQ6oCI o5s4BwZAyChZ02QfMCmfoLDmMNrLlFlIMfmH13leoaEtfMBjQugJ3bMNAeagQGsw2MVQ erkWxIR6gMcsMKe9IyoXY+l9wmxVqaPxPTbVa9Id6mq6SZy2zbgV++4RWxu1g9LarvuD jN67jAL0EJ48HAwVNEfsDQiISfTJKqP1kTVvpWuhPoiSEqhElI4PKzk7RcCDDIcNn2l8 K9hw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; h=list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-archive:list-help:list-post :list-id:mailing-list:precedence:reply-to:mime-version:feedback-id :message-id:subject:from:to:date:dkim-signature; bh=ApDU7Y99hja5p37XKy/ugwEhdbj+iCu9qH4wxPJP4oA=; fh=+bkfibyn0hsperTbFRN2ieNmIPv2i2yfH8GeTNSEQ/4=; b=OdJJ8+EeaqMm3qYdmJtQrfGqqV65IaHnUVF8gDUFrOmA1QhKoQ+RXEYqc12UgcIViI 74zY87usRUhW8EerxckIbLv+6D8HnEo+GlLMCiST0rRO+W1HiPSPQpXadUyu8uaCUu2V BywTJbOOz1LrQ4eRPT31mq+X35ljdqA2EgmiRqiUT6yTKt6IwHJGU8C9ODRuoMg4+uyk CEdXJ+6m9RmcVSfSkvgCg6X9Hdv44xlbAZOMvW4P2oURdMqqYUc4tz6dnGium6/n2Jwe e8ARbmMzMdAj+VINX0Ab3UFEDeunUIt/+ZoZHz9ru+DD/hC6adNIVssvtzXSTwtXQ/pZ IeCg==; darn=gnusha.org ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@proton.me header.s=protonmail header.b=JUoPX0UG; spf=pass (google.com: domain of 2099999997690000@proton.me designates 79.135.106.98 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=2099999997690000@proton.me; dmarc=pass (p=QUARANTINE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=proton.me DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20251104; t=1788979378; x=1789584178; darn=gnusha.org; h=list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-archive:list-help:list-post :list-id:mailing-list:precedence:reply-to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:content-type :mime-version:feedback-id:message-id:subject:from:to:date:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to:content-type; bh=ApDU7Y99hja5p37XKy/ugwEhdbj+iCu9qH4wxPJP4oA=; b=Uo8PP7MKFKLkxviqR8lLyKRO1q1HQ/YC5QgoIGhdQg/gDRLy+usZ2N+RKpEQedsAEh j4BwJFUvKWaHkrK5RE/FNVDluOL+Uc3p5R0W29Ze4HkI+ONwdT3QQPAm3OcI5vUvVzkd zTYRrjRTjVK0t1hQ5PtsK0xOqGboawpj2lNTW4VrnWQ4P510YOPwJ6EsN03dZfFO+TOl QRm3yXcLvTAO9/GTg5zZL08iYs0LbFUa1Q46wRFiuVabplMyDy1rLkdE4YQM2PhTrmuS jceeV/+zV7AWBwKSTAl0oYh985HGOJ1B7xM0e/IvjdDV0YTTAXIjna4sJuZs0Pm6GCMq I5GQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20251104; t=1788979378; x=1789584178; h=list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-archive:list-help:list-post :list-id:mailing-list:precedence:reply-to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:content-type :mime-version:feedback-id:message-id:subject:from:to:date :x-beenthere:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to:content-type; bh=ApDU7Y99hja5p37XKy/ugwEhdbj+iCu9qH4wxPJP4oA=; b=dORaMb6e6NeMStDjR3G5Qu2jXhH3B4BYTvPLW1abRocbf3jAsDg9dALSpqrpQuAyYh dqhd5VuDJesU6DWPwxYXSNfXS8XeqOtt1bD+8xQlfMlK/ZbVwRgiqt9M/oetGCID7+Hm sInfcHnN1Kac0y24xGHBWpnR6OcikXRmEloTISSzM5IX8ECXoQtAGsg/9vnfFgxEzAh1 tDO1L4nIETdpF+FlD5DcL5mmDvXk3gOYfjZiKsYGLzdKamVmGYW0ZaIpqEKfEBvutz6H +bA+yapOvE6NU+3ChQ39NaWORbQRqTmaEsAgn43hcLnxK6WFJoGTU7TrDD1wPUenF8Tx 0ZWA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=2; AKwUvBzVqEQ+6C3ohR9ODBzfKBKT9kCULaVZS2sN1aKuZQSlOssblbfo29YF/A4Wu9K3IwOpuqapa9XRWeXs@gnusha.org X-Gm-Message-State: AFuF++nAJYlC2Ip6HtExzfBAO2lDhJNhxnQNZaaEdwFUJXhM3df2TlPb hRWdLbHduN+Zv/Si62VgvDGQzjIWeEAFQmQnajrODn+F6uPaTqqy5Sni X-Received: by 2002:a05:6820:f028:b0:6b6:71f7:ecbe with SMTP id 006d021491bc7-6bee48ac119mr2700249eaf.18.1788979378064; Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:42:58 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; h="ATskLdfQQmQu1Sp28zh3ZKPesG5KOxGFzVpOyOjqnWylrIZK+Q==" Received: by 2002:a05:6820:c0d9:20b0:6b6:829d:517 with SMTP id 006d021491bc7-6bf4d78f897ls110195eaf.2.-pod-prod-02-us; Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:42:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:30a4:b0:495:eb86:6e8f with SMTP id 5614622812f47-4c142e28f2dmr3385757b6e.14.1788979374033; Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:42:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 2002:aa7:c0c3:0:b0:670:416a:5ab4 with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-6a998965819msa12; Wed, 9 Sep 2026 11:41:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:e00c:10b0:c26:18be:6982 with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-c2618be6dabmr916137866b.11.1788979266958; Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:41:06 -0700 (PDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1788979266; cv=none; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; b=VfI5NdU9Me0iTgPnm0Al0S6d2KQ9XI/i5MEm/2OlkrTHDZ5DdOrre/phR4eWMRFwKn iBrmHMl+BBOqAefftiNFYpwNijeAkc9EVGt/x0t2Nu/6eSV7qPKt7GzqMn7vvkRbjM3Y GGPg4z8gmdqwTBZBlAG2lpmQyr5jnKxCpCBcAZ417lxjD2AZQeXjr+4BGH5ys5PIEk/c gJKIJCCgwT3OfMXmDstMTVsx2M1xTV2XNxBRYZ5VvKALrLwQL2T2r6fNu44q891m0GMk oJiny/z6lQSaGyL1qgH8qrvJlAKN1vP7u9aR1rAdhd8QrfIw+jcFCpDIxwTOajYvOgIa /SYg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; h=mime-version:feedback-id:message-id:subject:from:to:date :dkim-signature; bh=gSLJyv04wvmHgP9VVrQlyVklFnvHFfzIlS0HL77YMVc=; fh=lhFSo2W/mHC0QoJ9oNg3A35n0DTltt3CQl1/0RggJlk=; b=Etmd+XmJHc6FZAvdC6geH+yQu5kt72PouAivQ969R+lLH9BY/O5T4Q0vxX96vR1Fvh cXPsrLHPMvDtDusPF2oEE+8u6t4ayTK+gfMAAnxJGKGCA6IDP+wrzI617TsUq3QEvSZS K05xpG0ngKhevw/VrnRcReyF/Oz77qR3Q9qkKbIvkro1HPqSPPNfGMu3wONqAO8J4+sn I99D7lNz3bbKyK7XR6vFsBrLzFViH5PH6//m/JVoJgZ8jr5cd17FIh4ydatCWAdllFVO LAEC0T9IEvvS1lpT0AuUiVeUEPq5E5SbQOeWdO0uTZkh0RKQXhQkM9oCrj8+gEgPwkbW dvFw==; dara=google.com ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@proton.me header.s=protonmail header.b=JUoPX0UG; spf=pass (google.com: domain of 2099999997690000@proton.me designates 79.135.106.98 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=2099999997690000@proton.me; dmarc=pass (p=QUARANTINE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=proton.me Received: from mail-10698.protonmail.ch (mail-10698.protonmail.ch. [79.135.106.98]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id a640c23a62f3a-c2945d5ea24si750466b.1.2026.09.09.11.41.06 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 09 Sep 2026 11:41:06 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of 2099999997690000@proton.me designates 79.135.106.98 as permitted sender) client-ip=79.135.106.98; Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2026 18:41:02 +0000 To: "bitcoindev@googlegroups.com" From: "'2099999997690000' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List" Subject: [bitcoindev] [BIP draft] Unspendable Internal Keys for Wallet Policies Message-ID: Feedback-ID: 170389540:user:proton X-Pm-Message-ID: a90d3e859e08cf8c04dc52b8a4ec07667dd9d853 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="b1=_AHOVdV4wTygSHY0Pykh6N4F1uyuvPPUOulCOuaAZA" X-Original-Sender: 2099999997690000@proton.me X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@proton.me header.s=protonmail header.b=JUoPX0UG; spf=pass (google.com: domain of 2099999997690000@proton.me designates 79.135.106.98 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=2099999997690000@proton.me; dmarc=pass (p=QUARANTINE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=proton.me X-Original-From: 2099999997690000 <2099999997690000@proton.me> Reply-To: 2099999997690000 <2099999997690000@proton.me> Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --b1=_AHOVdV4wTygSHY0Pykh6N4F1uyuvPPUOulCOuaAZA Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, Resending with the correct subject; the proposal is unchanged. Apologies fo= r the duplicate. Pursuant to the discussions about standardizing an unspendable NUMS key for= an script path only taproot policy https://delvingbitcoin.org/t/unspendabl= e-keys-in-descriptors/304 and https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/pull/1746 ; w= e undertook the issue with these guiding principles: - We don't police adherence to other bips except when they directly affect = the issue at hand. - We use the already in place mechanisms in other bips. - We don't claim semantic canonicalization of the script and only normalize= the policy to some opinionated extent. The gist is, we define _=E2=80=8B as a placeholder for the unspendable NUMS= key. We sort keys inside musig(...) and sortedmulti_a. We sort sibling pai= rs of the tree. If there is multipath extension, we add the same length tup= le to the _=E2=80=8B so that we don't fall to reuse. Then we pull the keys = out and us @i=E2=80=8B placeholders and hash the whole thing consisting of = the normalized descriptor and the keys. That would be the chain code for th= e H=E2=80=8B defined in BIP 341. The details can be found here: https://github.com/bitryonix/bips/blob/bip-xxxx-unspendable-internal-keys/b= ip-xxxx-unspendable-internal-keys.mediawiki Best,NTL --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/= ToQA7AIlDQoaVhHUgpy0MjUEy5FYvYQL1d1Lr_xgmIpEcjYBhuT2JkEDNddmPa-qgIziEzHcGS9= bHreVXUHLaSqDTjQtREHXkchtjphDbxQ%3D%40proton.me. --b1=_AHOVdV4wTygSHY0Pykh6N4F1uyuvPPUOulCOuaAZA Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all,
Resendi= ng with the correct subject; the proposal is unchanged. Apologies for the d= uplicate.

Pur= suant to the discussions about standardizing an unspendable NUMS key for an= script path only taproot policy https://delvingbitcoin.org= /t/unspendable-keys-in-descriptors/304 and https://github.com/bitcoin= /bips/pull/1746 ; we undertook the issue with these guiding princi= ples:

  1. We don't police adherence to other bips excep= t when they directly affect the issue at hand.
  2. We use the already in place mechanisms i= n other bips.
  3. We don't claim semantic canonicalization of the script and only normalize= the policy to some opinionated extent.

The gist is, we defin= e _=E2=80=8B as a placeholder for the unspendable NUMS key. We= sort keys inside musig(...) and sortedmulti_a. We sort sibling pairs of th= e tree. If there is multipath extension, we add the same length tuple to th= e _=E2=80=8B so that we don't fall to reuse. Then we pull the = keys out and us @i=E2=80=8B placeholders and hash the whole th= ing consisting of the normalized descriptor and the keys. That would be the= chain code for the H=E2=80=8B defined in BIP 341.
<= br>
The details can be found here:

Best,
NTL

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to bitcoind= ev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/ToQA7A= IlDQoaVhHUgpy0MjUEy5FYvYQL1d1Lr_xgmIpEcjYBhuT2JkEDNddmPa-qgIziEzHcGS9bHreVX= UHLaSqDTjQtREHXkchtjphDbxQ%3D%40proton.me.
--b1=_AHOVdV4wTygSHY0Pykh6N4F1uyuvPPUOulCOuaAZA--