For Garlo:

So, if we talk about disabling obsolete cryptography, then when OP_SHA1 will be disabled?

We are not talking about disabling obsolete cryptography. We are talking about adding new address formats to Bitcoin, with an eye specifically on resisting breaks in the ECDLP (such as by a CRQC). I hope you can see why enabling a new address format is a totally different proposition than your examples.

Well, to fully break OP_CHECKSIG, you need to break both secp256k1 and SHA-256.

This is not about OP_CHECKSIG or its future in script. See previous paragraph.


For Erik:

Covenant backed multistep secret-reveal schemes are inherently quantum resistant (as long as we eliminate the mandatory nums-spend-path with a small optional tr version addition)

I'd be excited to learn about this as an option. Erik, could you please answer my previous questions about the viability of your linked protocol? I'm not questioning its quantum-resistance properties (yet). I'm wondering how it is possible to instantiate this scheme in a way that allows a wallet to actually use this commit/reveal scheme without knowing the final destination CTV templates (denoted T & E in the delving post) in advance of creating the phase 0 locking script.

Quoting myself:

On one hand the author says phase zero doesn't commit to final CTV templates E & T. However it also says T & E are committed to via the P_anchor tapscript tree, which must be pinned by phase 0. So unless I'm misunderstanding, this technique seems to require a priori knowledge of template hashes T and E when creating the funding address and UTXO in phase 0, so this would not be viable as a PQ fallback spending path. Happy to be proven wrong.

If this is indeed possible i would be super joyed to see it. I just don't understand how it would be, based on my limited knowledge of TXHASH and CTV.

It's clearly too soon to pick a signature scheme for quantum.

Notwithstanding any forthcoming answers to my previous questions on covenant-based commit/reveal, i agree partially. Yes, it is too early to risk adding a new cutting edge cryptosystem that relies on novel assumptions, like closest-vector, or isogeny-path problems. There is much progress still to be made in attacking these schemes, and in improving their performance and flexibility.

But in the case of hash-based signature (HBS) schemes, i disagree. HBS is already mature. Whatever cryptanalytic breakthroughs the future holds, we can be reasonably sure that SHA256 preimage resistance will hold for a long time, so HBS security will hold. Even today md4 and md5 preimage resistance still holds. Securing coins using hashes alone is the ideal fallback, and even if HBS is not the most efficient class of schemes, that doesn't matter so much if we don't use HBS as our primary everyday signature scheme. Its value lies in security, not efficiency.

Once an efficient PQ scheme is mature, we can use that to someday replace ECDLP, and rely on HBS as a fallback once again.

If you're worried about stuff like how xpubs would work with HBS, we have solutions for that too, and they are mostly drop-in replacements for existing standards.

regards
conduition
On Friday, February 20th, 2026 at 6:48 PM, Erik Aronesty <erik@q32.com> wrote:
Covenant backed multistep secret-reveal schemes are inherently quantum resistant (as long as we eliminate the mandatory nums-spend-path with a small optional tr version addition)

It's clearly too soon to pick a signature scheme for quantum. Kyber is probably the most broadly accepted scheme, but nobody uses it without a hybrid approach, and it doesn't trivially support schemes like xpub key derivation.

But it's NOT too soon to add covenants, which can give people peace-of-mind quantum-safe vaults without needing to trust new quantum sigs.

On Mon, Feb 16, 2026 at 11:39 PM conduition <conduition@proton.me> wrote:
> I just don't see a reason to do P2MR over just utilizing P2TR (or maybe
P2TRv2).
>
> P2MR will *also* require an equivalent P2MR-disable-soft-fork



P2TRv2 means locking wallets into using elliptic curve code for as long as P2TRv2 exists, because you will always have to compute and verify the tweaked output pubkey. Future PQ Bitcoin wallet devs will see secp256k1 as we today see broken primitives like md5 or DES. Future devs shouldn't have to add legacy cruft EC libraries into their codebases when it's not even usable for cryptography anymore.

Even if you assume a second P2MR-disable-soft-fork will be needed (which is debatable), then it still pays to remove the inefficient and unnecessary cruft of EC crypto for the foreseeable post-quantum future. You might think of it as decoupling UTXO ownership from any specific public-key cryptosystem.

Furthermore, if EC/keypath spending is disabled, P2MR actually requires less witness space per input than P2TRv2 because we dont need the now-useless internal key in a P2MR script spend witness, whereas P2TRv2 will require it indefinitely until we can migrate to another new address format in the distant future. See https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0360.mediawiki#comparison-with-p2tr-script-path-spend

P2MR is strictly more secure since it depends on weaker assumptions. P2TRv2 is more complex for wallets to implement than P2MR, unless you count code reuse from P2TRv1. P2TRv2 is (marginally) computationally slower, and less block-space-efficient for script path spends. So who would choose P2TRv2 over P2MR?

The only redeeming factor of P2TRv2 is that it saves a few dozen witness bytes per input when using schnorr EC key spending, compared to P2MR spending. For low-frequency use cases like cold storage, that doesnt matter much. At current rates thats like 10 sats per input. For high frequency use cases where every vbyte counts like hot wallets, exchanges, mining payouts, etc, i have good news: P2TRv1 still exists and can be used just fine. You "just" need to make sure the coins are moved to a PQ address before a quantum computer attacks them. I'm assuming these high-frequency use case actors are online enough to take that last step when necessary.

Thus i see P2MR as the superior choice to P2TRv2 even if P2TRv2 may be slightly more space efficient in the near-term. Thinking longer term, P2MR is the better choice.

Thinking even further into the future, we have options for a sort of P2TR-style of address using isogenies, by hiding a commitment to a taproot-style script tree inside a public key curve (public keys in isogeny cryptosystems are represented by elliptic curves). Keypath spending would be via SQIsign (or other schemes). So don't worry, we are not stuck with only merkle trees forever. I'll elaborate more on this idea in a forthcoming article i have cooking on isogenies.


> ZK proof-of-seedphrase

If we were going to use a ZK proof to rescue quantum procrastinators, it should be proof of BIP32 hardened key derivation, and possibly also proof of pubkey hash preimage knowledge. This is strictly more general than a zero-knowledge proof of seed phrase, the arithmetization would be wayyy more efficient, and would recover more coins from more diverse wallet types.

Also, there is no need for it to be a hefty zero-knowledge proof, like a STARK. Rescue could be deployed using a commit and reveal protocol, as has been discussed on the list previously (sorry, i dont have the link in front of me right now). The idea is that a sender can rescue frozen UTXOs using a commit/reveal sequence of transactions which ultimately proves the sender knew a BIP32 parent xpriv (or pubkey hash preimage) which controls the coins in question through hardened BIP32 CKD, which a CRQC shouldn't be able to forge.

This would maximize rescue coverage while minimizing blockspace congestion, and could be done as a soft fork.


-----

I'm glad to see thoughtful discussion on the subject of how to handle a quantum freeze. But it is important to put this in perspective in the context of this thread: right now the number one most important thing - which we NEED to do if Bitcoin is to survive appearance of a CRQC - is to provide a standardized wallet address format which includes a secure fallback way to authenticate UTXOs if ECC is unsafe to use. We can debate about freezing or rescuing coins, or the philosophy of ownership, but these questions will not be decidable for years.

What is decidable is this: how would you change Ethan's proposal, if at all? I'll remind everyone that currently it is limited only to adding two features: BIP360 P2MR addresses, and SLH-DSA opcodes. Those two changes are all we need in consensus to finally give hodlers an option to migrate.


I've gone through and catalogued some of the feedback on Ethan's proposal. So far I've heard these material critiques:


1. Why not instead deploy covenant opcodes (TXHASH, CTV) and use them to implement commit/reveal?

As i mentioned in my last message i don't think that is possible, at least not using the technique Erik linked. I'd be happy to be proven wrong here because that'd be fantastic news if true.


2. Why not use SHRINCS instead of SLH-DSA?

Seems like a valid idea to me. SHRINCS would add implementation and UX complexity but it'd also make the fallback sig scheme scalable - a very nice property to have in the worst case scenario where a majority of users end up needing to sign with it. Philosophically i dislike statefulness in a cryptosystem, but maybe as a fallback it is an acceptable tradeoff.


3. Why not deploy GSR and let wallet devs roll their own crypto?

As ethan pointed out, this would be bad for standardization and interoperability, and also requires GSR to be deployed as a pre-requisite. If GSR is activated and in-script signing schemes are standardized correctly, it could possibly be a suitable alternative to activating dedicated SLH-DSA opcodes.


4. Why not continue using P2TR and disable keypath spending later, rather than adding a whole new address format?

As ethan pointed out, this depends on timing a future disabling soft fork correctly and will lead to FUD, avoidable debate, and confusion. It is also confiscatory, as it would freeze standardized keypath-only P2TR outputs which lack a script path.


5. Why not redeploy P2TR with a new segwit version number, which opts into a future keypath-disabling soft fork?

Ethan and i have both made some compelling arguments as to why we should give the community a new address format which is totally decoupled from any PQ-vulnerable cryptography. If the increased fees of P2MR are an issue for high-frequency hot wallets, P2TR is still viable, at least until Q-day. As stated Ethan's proposal is more motivated by long term cold storage use cases. I consider a small increase in witness size to be an acceptable tradeoff for (speculative) quantum security, and the costs of clinging to those savings in the near-term to be unacceptable. Key-path spending may be reinvented in the future using other novel cryptosystems, with another new address format that depends on new cryptographic assumptions.

-----

I apologize if i missed anyone's feedback notes in this summary. Please correct me if i have!

regards,
conduition


On Tuesday, February 17th, 2026 at 4:22 AM, 'conduition' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List <bitcoindev@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Hi list, just wanted to pipe in on the subject of commit/reveal using OP_TXHASH. I don't think it is possible. The protocol link Erik posted ( https://delvingbitcoin.org/t/a-quantum-resistance-script-only-using-op-ctv-op-txhash-and-no-new-signatures/2168 ) seems to contradict itself. On one hand the author says phase zero doesn't commit to final CTV templates E & T. However it also says T & E are committed to via the P_anchor tapscript tree, which must be pinned by phase 0. So unless I'm misunderstanding, this technique seems to require a priori knowledge of template hashes T and E when creating the funding address and UTXO in phase 0, so this would not be viable as a PQ fallback spending path. Happy to be proven wrong.

regards,
conduition



On Wednesday, February 11th, 2026 at 1:06 AM, Erik Aronesty <erik@q32.com> wrote:


You'd still need BIP 360 P2MR (or P2TRD) since OP_TXHASH needs tapscript, and the only available tapscript supporting output type, P2TR, isn't quantum safe.

false, covenant based multistep secret-reveal spending paths don't rely on signatures at all

I'm going to assume:
- you mean to use this commit-reveal for migrating between signature algorithms, not for everyday use,

it can be used if "q day" happens. otherwise ignored.
- TXHASH is being used because you are waiting for the commitment to be confirmed on-chain rather than lifeboat's out-of-band commitment system

it's used so you can commit to a spending constraint without committing to the final "as yet to be determined" quantum-safe destination: https://delvingbitcoin.org/t/a-quantum-resistance-script-only-using-op-ctv-op-txhash-and-no-new-signatures/2168
Once you post your commit-txn, but before it confirms, other parties can post competing commit-txns that double spend your output. If one of malicious transactions confirm, you must now wait for a timelock to expire and then try to post your transaction.

agreed. they have to spend resources to attack your private key and the only thing they can do is "grief" using a timing attack with the results, rather than steal outright. a massive incentive difference.
They can block you again. Each time they burn some of you coins in fees. Miners get the fees, so they might be incentivized to do this. Thus, we must trust miners not to do this. Lifeboat doesn't have this issue since it uses out-of-band commitments, but out-of-band commitments have their own issues.

each time you use the reset-path, they have to re-attack a new key. very expensive just to grief a small amount of fees spread across all miners. sounds like science-fiction levels of compute.

plus.... TX_HASH is simple and generally useful and there is no guarantee that q-day will even come

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